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Re: [atlarge-discuss] Some points of view - Limits and common sense
Jefsey and all fellow members,
Your remarks and comments in both languages below sound
good, but are just so much "Hogwash", Jefsey. Sotiris is right.
Even many, if not most Chinese Web sites for instance have
english versions. All of the chinese government folks I converse
with speak english or have translators to provide english versions
of their E-Mail to me or any member of our organization.
And even worse, your final remark or declaration below,
"When one accepts the vote of someone, one must accept him entirely.",
is beyond the limits of common sense. First of all not all votes are
made by "him's" and secondly not all votes are made for "Him's",
third no reasonable person, voter, or candidate, expects, or is
expected to except the voter or the candidate entirely, not even
in France! Sheeesh!
J-F C. (Jefsey) Morfin wrote:
> On 04:00 27/05/03, Sotiris Sotiropoulos said:
> >Just in case you have not noticed, this organization's discussion language
> >is English. ICANN's discussion language is English (see
> >http://www.icann.org/ and let me know where you find any Spanish). I am
> >happy for you that you speak Spanish well, but you will find that Spanish
> >will not help you to communicate with most of the members of this
> >organization, and your English is certainly not of sufficient quality for
> >advanced discussion(s) and deliberation(s). To be honest, your English is
> >so poor that I could not understand what your ideas are, in your brief two
> >week history among us. How can you expect to play any kind of a role as a
> >Panel member when your ability to effectively and succintly communicate
> >with most of the members (and fellow panelists) is in question?
>
> Cet argument semble raisonable mais il est en fait spécieux. Comment
> veux-tu pouvoir travailler dans un contexte international en ne respectant
> pas d'abord tes interlocuteurs. De façon totalement honnête ton anglais est
> la plus part du temps copréhensible, mais pas tes intentions ni tes
> motivations. Ceci signifie que tu es sans doute le membre que l'on comprend
> ici le moins. A commencer pourquoi es tu toujours là alors que _rien_ ne
> semble te satisfaire ? Personne n'a jamais dit que nous parlions anglais
> (en fait sur mon Word je memet en mode "américain" - l'anglais me serait
> conceptuellement plus familier): nous parlons de façon à être compris par
> tous (une lingua franca), c'est à dire _aussi_ par les moins ouverts.
>
> Il existe une règle que comprends chaque marin, scout ou fantassin, un
> convoi ou une troup avance à la vitesse du plus lent. Il y en a toujours
> qui râlent aulieu d'aider. Ils ajoutent à la confusion et en fait
> ralentissent encore plus les choses. Chaque Amiral, Guide ou Colonel le
> sait bien.
>
> Lorsqu'on accepte la voix de quelqu'un on doit l'accepter tout entier.
>
> PS in the case you would not have understood this I will help you understand:
>
> This argument seems reasonable. Actually it is erroneous. How do you want
> to work in an international context in not respecting first your
> interlocutors. Honestly your English is most of the time understandable,
> but not your intentions nor your motivations. This means that you are
> probably the Member one understand the least. The first question being why
> are yo still here while _nothing_ seems to make you happy? No one ever said
> that we spoke English (actually on my Word I switch to "American" -
> "English" would be conceptually more familliar): we try to speak in a way
> understood by everyone. A lingua franca. That is a way to be understood
> also by the least open minded.
>
> There is a rule that every seaman, scout or soldier understands, a convoy
> or a troop proceeds at the speed of the slowest. There are always some to
> protest instead of helping. They add to confusion and actually slow down
> the whole process. Each Comodore, Scout Girl or Colonel knows it well.
>
> When one accepts the vote of someone, one must accept him entirely.
> jfc
>
> >--Sotiris Sotiropoulos
> >
> >
> >A/S Mauro D. Ríos wrote:
> >
> >>Estimado Sotiris,
> >>
> >>Mi inglés es malo, si, muy malo, ¿y tu español?, ¿por qué debo hablar
> >>inglés y no tú español?. Cómo piensas trabajar en una organización
> >>global si no hablas español o chino (para ser realista con las
> >>mayorías) ?. Es mi español el problema o las ideas que no compartes?
> >>
> >>Te agradezco tu sinceridad. Te repito que si tanto te molesto, dímelo
> >>y consideraré retirarme, no quiero ser un estorbo.
> >>
> >>Muchas gracias por tu comentario,
> >>saludos
> >>Mauro.-
> >>
> >>---- english ----
> >>
> >>Dear Sotiris,
> >>
> >>If you don't want me to work in the organization, please tell it to me
> >>and I promise you to consider to retire.
> >>
> >>My English is bad, yer, very bad, and your Spanish?, why should I
> >>speak English and not you Spanish?. How do you plan to work in a
> >>global organization if you don't speak Spanish or Chinese (to be
> >>realistic for the majorities)?. Is my Spanish the problem or the ideas
> >>that you don't share?.
> >>
> >>I thank you your sincerity. I repeat you that if so much I bother you,
> >>tell it to me and I will consider to retire, I don't want to be a
> >>nuisance.
> >
> >
> >
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Regards,
--
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 131k members/stakeholders strong!)
"Be precise in the use of words and expect precision from others" -
Pierre Abelard
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