Re: [atlarge-discuss] No quorum

[Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com>]

Ron and all stakeholders or other interested parties and members,

Ron Sherwood wrote:

> There seems to be a lack of understanding among some members about the scope
> of responsibility, accountability and authority of the panel.

  I think yo are right.  So go look it up in the archives. Vittorio posted it.
I have reposted the Archived URl several times now in response.  If
any member missed it this many times, than they are simply not paying
attention.  That's each members personal responsibility, not mine,
yours or any other single members responsibility.

>
>
> There cannot be accountability without authority, yet I constantly read that
> the panel has zero authority to do anything.

  True and not true.  Yes true that "There cannot be accountability without
authority".
Not true that "t he panel has zero authority to do anything". You may be only
reading this, but it has been stated several times and the actual mandate
that we all voted upon for the Panel members has also been posted
and re-posted a number of times already.

> It seems that we expect them
> to accomplish certain tasks while being subjected to a barrage of criticism
> and complaint from every direction.

  Constructive but harsh criticism is constructive.  If it is not viewed that
way than the panel or panel members(s) should resign.

> It seems that we have eleven slaves and
> 1000 slavemasters (even if some slavemasters are more vocal than others).
> This is unacceptable and needs to change immediately.

  Not slaves, servants.  Big difference.

>
>
> It is reasonable for members to express their views on any task being
> performed by the panel.

  The panel should stick strictly to it's mandate.  The rest of the
members can self form WG or committees or independently work
on other issues and tasks as needed or come along.  That's called
boot strapping.  That is what at this juncture we MUST do.

> It is also reasonable for the panel to read and
> consider (and, if necessary, reconsider and reconsider) those comments.

  Sure!

>  A
> process which will naturally lead to them being accused of failing to make a
> decision quickly enough.  Add to this an environment where any decision is
> the wrong decision for someone, and where the panel is repeatedly told they
> have no authority to make a decision without a vote to decide whether or not
> they have the authority to make the decision they made...  and we have
> devolved into the ridiculous.

  Again the panel should work on getting the bylaws, charter, articles
of incorporation and last but not least, the mission statement in draft
form for the members to consider, amend, and than vote upon.
THAT'S IT!  Anything else the members should freely form
committees, WG's or independantly work on for the organization
and report of progress to this forum and thereby the members.
Pretty simple really...

>
>
> It is patently impossible for the panel to satisfy opposite points of view,
> or for that matter to perform any of the tasks required of them, if they
> remain subject to this type of daily (hourly) harassment.

  Harassment???  Hummm?  Well it could be construed that a non-member
spouting some such to the Panel members as harassment, but not so from
members.  Members together and independently are the souverns in a democratic
organization such as ours is suppose to be...

>
>
> Until they prove me wrong, I have total faith in the people that we elected
> do this difficult work for us.

  Ok that's fine.  But remember you are one member.  You have your
opinion.  I have mine, other members have theirs.  To the extent that
your opinion is considered superior by the rest of the members,
and can be clearly determined as such, than it is just your opinion.

>  I believe that, if we harass them to the
> point where they are unable to work, and eventually step down because the
> "effort-to-accomplishment ratio" is just too great, we will achieve NOTHING.

  If a leader cannot handle adversity, he/she should not and cannot
lead effectively...

>
>
> If a member of this organization has the authority to propose a solution to
> this sad state of affairs, I Propose that:
>
>     WE, the members of this group that is currently known as ICANATLARGE, do
> accord the members of our duly elected organizing panel the authority to
> accomplish, without the requirement of additional permissions or constraints
> from the membership, those tasks required of them in outline. Namely:
> 1) complete and provide to the membership for discussion and eventual
> ratification, a mission statement that simply but clearly declares the
> purpose and method of our organization.
> 2) complete and provide to the membership for discussion and eventual
> ratification a set of by-laws under which the organization may be
> incorporated.
> 3) complete and provide to the membership for discussion and eventual
> ratification a set of rules under which the organization's website should be
> managed and the appointment of a webmaster.
> 4) research and present to the membership for discussion and eventual
> ratification a recommendation for the type of incorporation that we should
> undertake and the location best suited to that incorporation.
> 5) research and present to the membership for discussion and eventual
> ratification the best methodology for dealing with membership polls,
> ratification votes, votes on other issues properly raised and appropriately
> supported, and elections.
> 6) arrange on behalf of our organization the process for registration or
> transfer of any trademarks and domain names to whatever legal entity is
> formed as the result of count 4) above.
>
> It is further proposed that:
> 7) while the authority hereby bestowed is limited to the above listed tasks,
> the panel may at any time request additional authority (e.g. to perform the
> incorporation of our organization according to the ratified will of the
> membership).  And, that if granted by a majority of voting members, such
> authority will not be questioned unless it is removed by similar process.
> 8) it is specifically confirmed in this proposal that the above limited
> authority and protection from constraint does not prevent the panel from
> appointing working groups or other advisory devices and does not prevent the
> panel from seeking membership input on any issue, directly or through the
> atlarge discuss list. Nor does it require such procedures.
> 9) the tasks in count 1) through 6) plus any additional tasks are not
> necessarily in order of priority but that the panel will, by weekly report,
> advise the membership of the progress being made on each count and an
> approximate time for expected completion.

  I agree with this Ron.  I do not agree with the seeming priority
to which you listed them.  Is that the actual priority that you Intend?

>
>
> Ron Sherwood
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <DannyYounger@cs.com>
> To: <james.love@cptech.org>
> Cc: <atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 2:47 PM
> Subject: Re: [atlarge-discuss] No quorum
>
> > Jamie writes:  << Danny, did you bother to vote for any of the panel
> members?
> > >>
> >
> > Nice way to duck the issue Jamie.  You and your fellow panelists were
> elected
> > with a mandate to draft the bylaws for this organization.  You haven't
> done
> > so, and continue to demonstrate no inclination to ever do so.  Without a
> > Charter to guide organizational activities you are even more illegitimate
> > than ICANN.  As this last no-quorum incident reveals, there is no
> > accountability at the Panel level.
> >
> > Do your job and draft the bylaws.
> >
> >
> >
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> >
>
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Regards,
--
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup - (Over 127k members/stakeholders strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com
Contact Number: 214-244-4827 or 972-244-3801
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208



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