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Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris Sotiropoulos FUD follows Hugh Blair FUD to: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris, Where is that Registered Restricted Letter? Re: [atlarge-discuss] Provisional Membership Committee

To: Joanna Lane <jo-uk@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris Sotiropoulos FUD follows Hugh Blair FUD to: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris, Where is that Registered Restricted Letter? Re: [atlarge-discuss] Provisional Membership Committee
From: Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 19:12:12 -0700
Cc: Ron Sherwood <sherwood@islands.vi>, Sotiris Sotiropoulos <sotiris@hermesnetwork.com>, atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de
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Joanna and all fellow members,

Joanna Lane wrote:

> Sending a registered letter to a PO Box is not sufficient evidence on its
> own to verify that a person is who they say they are. There would need to be
> other evidence of the name as well.
>
> The owner of a PO Box receives any mail sent that address, regardless of who
> it is addressed to, so the PO Box Jeff has provided may exist, but be
> registered in another name.

  Not true at all in the US.  See: USPS regulations or call you the
post master Generals office yourself.  You are required to provide
legal proof of identity to acquire a P.O. Box.  But you would
be correct for a drop Box. They are NOTone in the same thing
or entity.


If you don't believe me, send a letter to my PO

> Box, and/ or to Michael's PO Box, (doesn't have to be registered) both
> addressed to Jeff Williams, with secret code.
>
> Joanna
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Ron Sherwood [mailto:sherwood@islands.vi]
> > Sent: 12 June 2003 07:59
> > To: Sotiris Sotiropoulos
> > Cc: atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de
> > Subject: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris Sotiropoulos FUD follows Hugh
> > Blair FUD to: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris, Where is that
> > Registered Restricted Letter? Re: [atlarge-discuss] Provisional
> > Membership Committee
> >
> >
> > Sotiris:
> >
> > A Panel member who belligerently declares that he will only verify Jeff
> > Williams if he provides a mailing address that can receive a Restricted
> > Delivery letter.  And then, when an address is provided, that Panel member
> > spends days spouting myriad excuses for not doing so, there is a serious
> > credibility issue.
> >
> > Your latest excuse is that Jeff Holt is going to try to meet with Jeff
> > Williams at some point in time and space that may or may not happen
> > depending upon the will of both parties. Why would you use this
> > latest ploy
> > to evade doing what you said you would do days ago?  If you really want to
> > verify Jeff Williams.  Sending the letter may save Jeff Holt an 800 mile
> > road trip and all the time and expenses involved.  If Jeff Holt makes the
> > trip anyway you have a double verification.  If The letter is returned as
> > undeliverable you can claim that Jeff is not verified. If Jeff Williams
> > doesn't show up for a face to face meeting, you have doubly
> > verified that he
> > is a fraud as you claim. If you don't send the letter and Jeff Williams
> > claims that he somehow missed Jeff Holt at the meeting place, we have made
> > zero progress.  And you look even sillier for failing to do what you said
> > you would do.
> >
> > Just do it, Sotiris... send the letter.  I would do it myself (at a far
> > lower cost to me, since I am paying your outrageous Canadian postal cost
> > anyway).  The only reason that I have not already done so is
> > because I don't
> > want to risk being subjected to your venomous condemnation as a fraud if I
> > have to report that I did indeed receive proof of delivery.
> >
> > Ron Sherwood
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Sotiris Sotiropoulos" <sotiris@hermesnetwork.com>
> > To: "Ron Sherwood" <sherwood@islands.vi>
> > Cc: <atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de>
> > Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2003 7:02 AM
> > Subject: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris Sotiropoulos FUD follows Hugh
> > Blair FUD to: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris, Where is that Registered
> > Restricted Letter? Re: [atlarge-discuss] Provisional Membership Committee
> >
> >
> > > Ron,
> > >
> > > In case you hadn't noticed (how could you not?), Jeff Holt has offered a
> > > face to face meet-up with our JW.  I defer to his approach as it will
> > > conclusively establish the verification of JW.  Now, you can continue
> > > calling me names (sticks and stones etc.,), but understand that in light
> > > of the offer made by Jeff Holt, I would be happy to let him provide us
> > > with conclusive evidence.
> > >
> > > --Sotiris Sotiropoulos
> > >
> > > P.S.  BTW, I have nothing personal against JW, Ron, so please do not
> > > waste your time and energies trying to make a mountain out of a
> > molehill.
> > >
> > >
> > > Ron Sherwood wrote:
> > >
> > > >Sotiris:
> > > >
> > > >My mailing address is a P.O. Box.  It is the only address that you can
> > send
> > > >mail to.  I am paying for you to send a Restricted Delivery letter to
> > Jeff
> > > >Williams at his P.O. Box address.  You have said many times that you
> > will,
> > > >but on every occasion you have reneged on that promise.  It seems that
> > your
> > > >word is absolutely worthless.  How can you so patently and so blatantly
> > show
> > > >your willingness to discriminate against someone that you dislike in a
> > > >simple process that will cost you nothing.
> > > >
> > > >Again, Sotiris, this is nothing to do with whether you like or dislike
> > Jeff
> > > >Williams. Or whether you want or do not want him to be verified. It is
> > about
> > > >telling the world that you will send a Restricted mail letter
> > to Jeff if
> > he
> > > >gives you an address to send it to.  You have repeatedly said that you
> > will
> > > >and have repeatedly made excuses for not doing so.  You are
> > showing every
> > > >member of this organization that your word means nothing, that
> > you place
> > > >your own subjective viewpoint before the organizational rules that you
> > > >proposed and that you have applied to others.
> > > >
> > > >If you do not immediately send a Restricted Delivery letter to the
> > mailing
> > > >address that Jeff Williams provided you will indelibly brand
> > yourself as
> > a
> > > >cheat and a liar and unfit for any office.
> > > >
> > > >Just do it Sotiris. Stop the excuses.
> > > >
> > > >Ron Sherwood
> > > >
> > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > >From: "Sotiris Sotiropoulos" <sotiris@hermesnetwork.com>
> > > >To: "Jeff Williams" <jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com>
> > > >Cc: <atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de>
> > > >Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2003 11:47 PM
> > > >Subject: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris Sotiropoulos FUD follows Hugh
> > Blair
> > > >FUD to: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris, Where is that Registered
> > > >Restricted Letter? Re: [atlarge-discuss] Provisional
> > Membership Committee
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>A P.O. Box is NOT a proper address.  You live somewhere... please send
> > > >>me the addres where you reside.  You can do so offlist if you
> > so choose,
> > > >>but I will not consider a P.O. box to be a proper, verifiable address.
> > > >> There's a reason why mail orders don't deliver to P.O. boxes.
> > > >>
> > > >>--Sotiris Sotiropoulos
> > > >>
> > > >>Jeff Williams wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>Sotiris and all fellow members,
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Hugh was incorrect.  The address I gave you 7 times now
> > > >>>is my legal and proper Mailing address.  The address for
> > > >>>My company is 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. As I have so many
> > > >>>times pointed out.
> > > >>>My proper Mailing address is and has been for 14 years is:
> > > >>>Jeffrey A. Williams
> > > >>>p.o. Box 1843
> > > >>>Frisco Texas, 75034
> > > >>>
> > > >>>usps phone # for Dallas and the Frisco area is:
> > > >>>1-800-275-8777 - Ask for direct line to the Frisco
> > > >>>post office.
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Sotiris Sotiropoulos wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>>Thanks to Hugh, for pointing out the dilemma involved in pinning Mr.
> > > >>>>Jeff Williams down to a fixed address.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>--Sotiris Sotiropoulos
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>Hugh Blair wrote:
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> > > >>>>>>From: Jeff Williams
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>No mail Box's on Route 1,Rual area of Gunter.  Hence why
> > > >>>>>>my Mailing address for mail delivery is p.o.. Box 1843 Frisco
> > > >>>>>>Texas 75034 and has been for 14 years.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>Been there "for 14 years"? Are you lying now - or then?
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>http://www.fitug.de/icann-europe/0106/msg00019.html
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>http://dict.regex.info/ipv6/6bone/6bone.mail-1999-05/0060.html
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > >
> > >>>>>http://www.icann.org/comments-mail/comment-dnso/archive/msg00051.html
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01587.html
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > >
> > >>>>http://www.apnic.net/mailing-lists/apnic-talk/archive/2000/02/
> > msg00023.h
> > t
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >ml
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/ietf/Current/msg18671.html
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>http://archive.nznog.org/2001-07/msg00158.html
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > >
> > >>>>http://lists.research.netsol.com/pipermail/uwho/2001-November/
> > 000023.htm
> > l
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>>Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>There's 8 *different* lists where you posted an address - within
> > > >>>>>the last "14 years" that's different from "Gunter". So when were
> > > >>>>>you lying? Then? Now? Are you even in Texas? Kansas? Oz?
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>Just more TEXAS BULL.
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>Hugh
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > >
> > >>>>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
> > > >>>>>For additional commands, e-mail:
> > atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>--
> > > >>>>-----------
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>"The science of jurisprudence regards the state and power as the
> > > >>>>ancients regarded fire- namely, as something existing absolutely.
> > > >>>>But for history, the state and power are merely phenomena,
> > just as for
> > > >>>>modern physics fire is not an element but a phenomenon.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>>From this fundamental difference between the view held by history
> > > >>>>and that held by jurisprudence, it follows that
> > jurisprudence can tell
> > > >>>>minutely how in its opinion power should be constituted and what
> > > >>>>power- existing immutably outside time- is, but to
> > history's questions
> > > >>>>about the meaning of the mutations of power in time it can answer
> > > >>>>nothing."
> > > >>>>                                    --Leo Tolstoy, "War and Peace"
> > > >>>>
> > >
> > >>>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >>>>To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
> > > >>>>For additional commands, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>--
> > > >>>Jeffrey A. Williams
> > > >>>Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 131k
> > members/stakeholders strong!)
> > > >>>"Be precise in the use of words and expect precision from others" -
> > > >>>   Pierre Abelard
> > > >>>===============================================================
> > > >>>CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security
> > > >>>Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
> > > >>>E-Mail jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com
> > > >>>Contact Number: 214-244-4827 or 214-244-3801
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>--
> > > >>-----------
> > > >>
> > > >>"The science of jurisprudence regards the state and power as the
> > > >>ancients regarded fire- namely, as something existing absolutely.
> > > >>But for history, the state and power are merely phenomena, just as for
> > > >>modern physics fire is not an element but a phenomenon.
> > > >>
> > > >>From this fundamental difference between the view held by history
> > > >>and that held by jurisprudence, it follows that jurisprudence can tell
> > > >>minutely how in its opinion power should be constituted and what
> > > >>power- existing immutably outside time- is, but to history's questions
> > > >>about the meaning of the mutations of power in time it can answer
> > > >>nothing."
> > > >>     --Leo Tolstoy, "War and Peace"
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >>To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
> > > >>For additional commands, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
> > > >For additional commands, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > -----------
> > >
> > > "The science of jurisprudence regards the state and power as the
> > > ancients regarded fire- namely, as something existing absolutely.
> > > But for history, the state and power are merely phenomena, just as for
> > > modern physics fire is not an element but a phenomenon.
> > >
> > > From this fundamental difference between the view held by history
> > > and that held by jurisprudence, it follows that jurisprudence can tell
> > > minutely how in its opinion power should be constituted and what
> > > power- existing immutably outside time- is, but to history's questions
> > > about the meaning of the mutations of power in time it can answer
> > > nothing."
> > >      --Leo Tolstoy, "War and Peace"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
> > For additional commands, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
> For additional commands, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de

--
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 131k members/stakeholders strong!)
"Be precise in the use of words and expect precision from others" -
    Pierre Abelard
===============================================================
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com
Contact Number: 214-244-4827 or 214-244-3801



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Follow-Ups:
- [atlarge-discuss] this is intolerable!
  - From: Sotiris Sotiropoulos <sotiris@hermesnetwork.com>

References:
- RE: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris Sotiropoulos FUD follows Hugh BlairFUD to: Re: [atlarge-discuss] Re: Sotiris,Where is that Registered Restricted Letter? Re: [atlarge-discuss] ProvisionalMembership Committee
  - From: Joanna Lane <jo-uk@rcn.com>

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