Re: [atlarge-discuss] Short-term goals

[espresso@e-scape.net]

At 11:02 -0700 2002/10/02, NameCritic responded to some of my comments on his previous posting:

>Chris wrote; So you think that language is the guage for participation? Do
>you also have the figures for how many of those that speak other languages
>or build sites in other languages that reside in the US? In other words, >not all people who speak other languages reside outside the US.

I am well aware of that. However, although many people and companies in the U.S. build multilingual Web sites, surveys of the number of Internet users are generally done by country. I'd be astonished if the majority of Swedish- or Korean-language Web sites were operated from the U.S. I'd be equally astonished if many Americans were subscribers to German or Indian ISPs.

>Chris wrote; This is not a contest about which country is bigger or my
>country can beat up your country. I have long been an advocate of equal
>access, so you have somehow placed me into a category in your own mind that
>I am US Centric and do not see that other cultures exist. For your
>information I live in Mexico. Maybe before becoming "snippy" or flying off
>the handle you should do a little research. let's bring up an International
>organization like say, UNICEF. Do you know what percentage of donations to
>UNICEF come from US Corporations? How about to the Red Cross?

My objections to your assumptions were not a matter of irrational anti-Americanism on my part. The extent of U.S. corporations' donations to UNICEF or the Red Cross are not at issue here, however large they might be.
I simply rejected your assumption that this organization should necessarily choose to incorporate as a 501C-3 under U.S. law, for what I believe are sound reasons -- e.g., that we have not yet considered which jurisdiction might be most advantageous for *this* international organization, and that envisioning this organization as gearing itself primarily to U.S. tax-deductibility should not be our primary concern.

>The fact that you get defensive to another's
>proposal and try to attack the message and the messenger rather than add
>something positive like maybe we need to do multiple filings in multiple
>countries. Why is it you don't choose the more positive approach?

If you read my message again, I think you may find that I did not attack you personally although I disagreed with what you said and why I believe you said it.

We have already discussed here the need for organizations of Internet users in as many countries as possible. What we were discussing at that moment was the status of this organization, which does need to be incorporated somewhere in the near future if it's to have any meaning at all.


>Judyth wrote; There are nearly as many Europeans online as Americans, and I
>believe there are now as many Asians, so perhaps it is time to start
>thinking in terms of a fairly decentralized structure in which national or
>regional organizations would look after their own fundraising (once they >are set up to do it) and contribute something to the umbrella-group.
>
>Chris wrote; I would like to see the stats on that, because although the
>online population from other countries is growing reducing the US user %,
>the stats I research for marketing tell me 80% of the money is being spent
>on the net by US users and that US surfers make up a little over 65% of all
>users. But I don't want to debate this point any further. The above was
>finally a positive suggestion. Thank you. It still doesn't answer the
>questions about where to file the paperwork but it is a good operational
>suggestion. Let's work together.

I can't say I much like messages where I'm accused of something in the response to one paragraph and then praised for "finally" being more positive in another. Anyway, statistics on Internet use are generally available, reported in newspapers, etc. so it's not down to me to prove them. 

Whom to target in a *marketing* campaign depends very much on what you are trying to market. Americans do indeed spend more money on surfing and buying online than most other peoples because, very generally: 
1) they have more disposable income to begin with
2) they have more free time for surfing
3) they are more trusting when it comes to dealing with total strangers about unknown products of unproven value
4) more of them have credit cards, unlimited broadband access, and a fondness for recreational consumer goods.
Of course, the more affluent Asians and Europeans are adopting the same spending habits to some extent but the rest of the world -- by the way, including that half of the U.S. population that can't afford these behaviours even if they wanted to engage in them -- which one can simply disregard when the purpose is to sell a product via the Web, cannot be disregarded when what we are (presumably) planning to market is an organization which allows Internet users anywhere in the world to make their needs known to the powers-that-be. 

This latter task is something that simply doesn't relate to the number of dollars spent online or the number of people who use the Internet primarily to "surf" the Web. There are many other ways of using the Internet than buying online, and we presumably want to engage those users, too.


>Judyth wrote; Finally, thus far we haven't the faintest chance of applying
>for funding in any country since we have not yet been able to agree upon
>what we will be doing and what will be involved in that effort. In fact,
>most sources of funding want to see evidence that an organization is in
>operation and doing something useful before they will consider an
>application. At the very least, they want to see a charter, budget
>projections and detailed plans before providing even start-up funding.
>
>Chris wrote; Yes! I agree. That is why I made the suggestions in the order >I made them. Mission Statement time?

You bet! In fact, I'd say that should be our first priority.

>Chris wrote; I agree 100% to the above as well. See our thinking isn't all
>that far apart, so please don't assume that it will be automatically >because of a few negative people you may have encountered in the past.

I made no such assumption, nor will I. The value of a democratic organization is that it brings together people with all kinds of opinions and strengths and helps them find their way to an effective, collective method of asking for what they want.

Regards,

Judyth

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Judyth Mermelstein     "cogito ergo lego ergo cogito..."
Montreal, QC           <espresso@e-scape.net>
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"A word to the wise is sufficient. For others, use more."
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