Re: [atlarge-discuss] Some Simple Facts...

["J-F C. (Jefsey) Morfin" <jefsey@club-internet.fr>]

On 08:48 06/01/03, DPF said:
> Oh grow up you silly little man.
Are you so sure you are above used car resellers?
I known that Canadian politicians were accustomed to that kind of 
notiquette, I did not know about NZ.
This might be an additional reason why nz@large is necessary :-) to my 
benefit this time.

I note that you do not respond the conclusion of my mail. And actually put 
yourself in the place I acknowledge to Jesus.

I understand your exasperation at your ideas not getting through. But you 
describe the process yourself. You float your ideas, if they are not 
accepted you will still sleep tonoght. Have a good rest.

Now, you make an interesting proposition. I suppose you are an educated 
politician and perfectly know that Fascism is a kind of political system of 
which the specifics correspond to what Joe Sims does and you propose to 
copy to better fight it (this has nothing to do with what Fascist or other 
allied regimes may have done in the past). So I read your proposition of 
taking over as the dictatorship of the old roman constitution or the 
Article 16 of the French constitution. I suppose Korea has it as several 
other countries. This kind of mergency powers are always interesting to 
consider if they are proposed in good faith, as they are here. The problem 
is legitimacy: not from election but from compeence.

This would give "power" on a temporary basis to a person or to a group of 
decision makers you would designate. What warranty of competence would we 
have?

IMHO this is a confusion of space. Your propositions would probably work - 
but you would be faught hardly - in a corporation, in a country, etc. But 
we are in cyberspace. There is no power except the attraction of talent. If 
people are not interested, they just fade away. Votes are not to elect you, 
they are to select you. They do not give anyone any power, they just say 
that you could be the best to convince them. I do not know how much you 
know about cybernetics (Wiener, Coufignal): this is the science of making 
action ... efficient in using models in herited from feed-backs. The 
cyberspace is made by its feed-backs. You discover you are attacked, you 
discover than someone responds. This is the world of "a posteriori" which 
is quite different of our common world of "a priori". I beg the right to 
say that in the cyberspace some rules of the direct space may have to be 
adapted, all those based upon "a priori": they are to be tuned in order to 
replace the "a prirori" by the parameter of the "usual model". This is what 
we try to learn.

If you want to set-up a panel and develop your own organization: you can 
proceed right away. You will not have more or less legitimacy than the 
panel. You will only have to convince that you are better.

This is what you could do through your success in nz@large. SHowing that 
you know about organizing a site, about organizing a local registrant 
meeting, to propose interesting solutions and get them implemented, to 
dialog with @large from other places, assuming and probably tuning you 
conception of power.

Again the whole issue is the misunderstanding of the very nature of the 
network.
That misunderstanding is all the way down from IAB to us.

The internet is NOT a centralized network under the control (chose: IAB, 
IETF, ICANN, Congres)
The internet is not a cooperative network by stakeholders, operators or ccTLDs
The internet is a distributed open interconnect of networks, the nteworks 
of the @large.

IAB starts understanding it. More and more IETF people have understood but 
this not yet the leading feeling since most are well paid people to think 
otherwise. The ERC in a way accepts it. Dick Clarke next week will present 
the WH positions and I doubt that he will go any otherway than yours, but 
in the interest of the USA, acknowledging this way the very nature of the 
nets and trying to control them far more than ICANN ever tried. EU has 
probably understood a lot. As a political advisor, I would advise you to 
correctly advise the Deputy you work for. This is going to be the issue of 
the century.

This is also the problem we and the ICANN is confronted. However we are 
fully cyberspace at this time while ICANN is also geospace. This is another 
reason why we need nz@large. Because the NZ House know the NZ incorporated 
consumer organization, it does not know ectoplasm such as 
"icannatalarge.org" and would not be excited at an US, French, Canadian, VI 
or else non profit organization wanting to relate with them.

jfc

























---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-unsubscribe@lists.fitug.de
For additional commands, e-mail: atlarge-discuss-help@lists.fitug.de