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RE: [atlarge-discuss] 003 WG-ID membership criteria

Joanna & Joop (et al):

At 11:08 AM 8/18/2002 -0400, Joanna Lane wrote:


Concerns have been expressed to me offlist about why I would want to
discourage anonymous contributions in this way, so maybe an explanation is
needed.
It's good leadership Joanna that you bring from off-list to on-list things that are material to our effort. Bravo. I commit, and I hope all of us commit to do likewise. The operative word is “material” which this matter most surely is.

This organization is not a DNSO constituency for corporations. It is for the
general public at large to obtain a vote in the process, representation
through direct participation.

First, a voter is not a voter without a name and some ID, it doesn't matter
who you work for, or what democracy you live in.
Exactly.

Whether and how we might want to protect the anonymity of a real person, if at all (I can imagine good reasons, but currently fear it too “sticky”), after verification they cannot remain anonymous to our verification and certification as a real, singular, identifiable human being.

So far as I know now all are free to use fictitious names for the purposes of debate and discussion, but actual voting is another matter entirely. I believe volunteering requires the same substantiality.

You are quoted back below as previously having written:

Although we have yet to go through the process of developing a policy for verification of members, I think it's safe to assume that we do not and will not be giving out votes to people who put down generic job descriptions rather than identify themselves as a real person with a real name.
I think indeed your assumption is safe and correct. As our interim “leaders” as well as panelists you have a fiduciary duty to keep us safe from the very harm we’ve been fighting all this while. It is a simple matter of common sense and self-preservation.

My druthers are that we establish “Identification & Verification” by whatever means necessary and sensible as soon as possible and before any more votes on anything, and in the meantime trust in the common sense and wisdom of the panel to get us there through acting as a committee of the whole and pass on every last new membership application for voting. You are certainly showing me you are worthy of MY trust.

Otherwise we risk having a “stuffed” ballot box before we even get to vote.

I am paranoid enough to appreciate we are being watched, and reported on. Whether directly through a current member(s) or by folks simply reading our lists. And I can tell you that right about now we are scaring the hell out of some people!

They are witnessing the determination, energy, intelligence, commitment and the means and wisdom to birth a democratic Internet!

And “they” hain’t liking it one bit! No sirree. And they will waste no effort, no energy, and no trick of foul play to STOP us!

I would go so far as to say that right now, this every second, we ought to close and bar the doors to our “Democratic Internet Convention Hall” to any new representatives or voters until we have agreed to our constitution, corporate structure (I like Jefsey’s thoughts on the subject; much akin to my own thoughts and experience as to being the least hierarchical) and verification process.

As good old Ben Franklin would remind us, let's hang together folks, and not let ourselves be infiltrated. We are so close, so close to success I can taste it!

All we have to do right now is to “keep on keeping on.”

I am one of the most inclusivity-seeking people I know and I have learned and know for certain one sure thing. If I insist on “fair play,” as I am inclined to define it, 100% of the time, then what I end up with is being fairly “played” 100% of the time by folks who DON'T define it as I do. Let's not be “played” people.

I AM a really, really nice guy and really DO “want to buy the world a Coke and keep it company,” and no one, but no one, should mistake me for a fool for even a second! Now that’s the Real Thing! And, at long last, WE are fast becoming the REAL THING.

Second, it would be extremely foolish to go down the road of asking private
corporations who have a vested interest in the process elsewhere to verify
our membership database for us.

I really like your SUBTLE understatement Joanna. ;)


Third, we have been elected by people who have had the courage to stand up
and be counted, real living breathing human beings with names and faces. And
as demonstrated in 2000 elections, there are tens of thousands of them out
there more than willing to be identified in order to get a vote and who,
right now, are very, very angry indeed to have their votes stolen from them
by ICANN, not only in the At Large, but also the DNSO GA, in fact
everywhere.

Amen sisters and brothers! Go Joanna. You GO girl!


Fourth, it's also not a good idea to stand in the front line, only to be
accused of fighting for a bunch of anonymous corporate employees (nothing
personal intended). The smart move is to use our personal ID as our
ammunition.

STRATEGIC!


We really don't need to know the kind of detail that Joey Star
Walker is giving out in his entertaining personal diaries,...
ROTL - LMAO ;-())

:) :) … Yes, I think, by now and quite understandably, most recognize that with me every thing personal is political and everything political is personal. I’ll be dead soon enough for it to be otherwise. :)

Plus I really like to tell stories. Mine is the one I know best. :) And I do like to entertain the folks I traveling with.

I’m rather fond of having people -- who when they’ve had enough -- in the same real space, as well as in the same virtual space, tell me, a la George Burns and Gracie Allen, “Say ‘Goodnight’ Gracie.” ;-) On this point then, “Goodnight Gracie.”

...but if you're
asking me to voluntarily fight for you without even Identifying yourself to
me, then you're being unrealistic. This has to be a two way street or it's
not going to work in my opinion.

INSANE, not unrealistic.


So, to recap, the view from here is that at this early stage, only
individuals who are willing to go through an ID process get votes, and not
those hiding behind corporations or other organizations, and that WG-ID is
being set up to help us clarify those issues and develop appropriate
policies that first and foremost protect the public interest - not the
corporate paymasters.
Because of this incredibly important work to be done I have bristled at Vittorio’s crack about my having the time to check E-mails three times a day, and given him a good “what for.”

Joanna, in your post I’m reacting to here you have made it as clear as it can be made the urgency for our WG work on this.

Now, the fact of the matter is that I DO have lots of time over these next several weeks to give nearly 24/7 to this work. I know I am fortunate in that regard.

I don’t have a day job, nor even a night job. The job I do have is building my own house AT MY OWN LEISURE. [See http://207.36.60.225/salt_box/index.htm… soon to be updated]

By the evidence I see on our lists I see that so many of you, if not all, do have jobs and yet it seems that likewise many of you appear to be giving 24/7 as well.

This inspires me to want to do even more. This is why I said above “I can taste it!” I do not fear burn out, or loss of enthusiasm. I’ve been there, and done that already, and learned how not to, ever again. I know when and how to recreate and take vacations. I know how to socialize.

[Aside: I will have something published to the list by the end of this day on my jump-start of the FUN!!! WG. WE can all use it.]

While at times it may not appear like it I pace myself, I DO pace myself. It’s just that I’m a Ferrari in a mostly Yugo world. I see clearly here that I’m not the only one. :) :) (I love rally driving!)

Joanna I give you my 100% support. YOU HAVE EARNED IT!

That doesn't mean your personal information is going to be published in the
public domain, but it does mean it has to be known to the current
administration of this organization, which at this time includes me, hence I
am going to continue flagging those that appear to be corporate or
organizational votes that have slipped through net. In that way, the
integrity of the organization's membership roster is best protected.

Spoken to above and still worth another BRAVO.


I'll be posting something shortly on the Name issue, as I sense we can start
to wrap that up, or at least move forward.

Regards,
Joanna
I would like, if you can, you to give me the earliest possible heads up on the top contender name, earliest today if possible and ethical. That has been the primary thing holding me back on setting up the social space; wanting to possibly weave the name in, or maybe not.

Name suggestions anyone? For the fun space?

Thanks for reading... Cordially... /s/ Joey

Sunday, August 18, 2002 * 1:09 PM EDT USA

=====
Power is not only what you have but what the enemy thinks you have.
---
Saul Alinsky (1909–72), U.S. radical activist. Rules for Radicals, “Tactics” (1971).
=====

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joanna Lane [mailto:jo-uk@rcn.com]
> Sent: Sunday, August 18, 2002 4:21 AM
> To: Joop Teernstra
> Cc: Atlarge Discuss List
> Subject: [atlarge-discuss] 003 WG-ID membership criteria
>
>
> Hi Joop,
> I was just reviewing the website quickly and noticed,"*
> Webmaster, Validweb
> Limited. From London, United Kingdom" as one of the latest
> additions to the
> Membership List. Although we have yet to go through the process of
> developing a policy for verification of members, I think it's
> safe to assume
> that we do not and will not be giving out votes to people who put down
> generic job descriptions rather than identify themselves as a real person
> with a real name.
>
> Please remove this and any other similar entries from the Voting
> Roster and
> Announce lists, and send me a note offlist of the contact name(s)
> (if known)
> with email address, so that I may send a note to each of the individuals
> responsible, inviting them to join properly using their own names.
>
> Thanks,
> Joanna
>
>
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