[atlarge-discuss] RE: [atlarge-panel] Re: [atlarge-discuss] let keep cool, organized and simple

["Judith Oppenheimer" <joppenheimer@icbtollfree.com>]

Why does it remind me of Stuart Lynn's "go forth and multiply"?

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Judith Oppenheimer
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Richard Henderson [mailto:richardhenderson@ntlworld.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 10:26 AM
> To: atlarge-panel@lists.fitug.de; J-F C. (Jefsey) Morfin
> Cc: atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de
> Subject: [atlarge-panel] Re: [atlarge-discuss] let keep cool,
> organized
> and simple
>
>
>
>
> Basically, I am in great agreement with Jefsey, because in my
> opinion he has
>
> (a) identified the multiplicity of groups that should grow
> up, with varied
> missions, varied interests, and probably each desiring a
> varied web presence
> (in varied languages etc)
>
> (b) identified an "architecture" which would help empower
> these groups,
> while retaining some overarching identity - this "architecture" is
> imaginative and has the potential to be really successful
>
> (c) identified one approach to setting this up - which can be
> compared with
> other proposals of course.
>
> My ideal would be 50 varied groups, each FTP-ing their own
> identity and
> concerns onto their own "portion" of netspace. This could
> then grow to 200+
> groups as the movement grows more diverse, more
> international, more local.
>
> What we should be aiming to build is a network of autonomous
> communities,
> and I feel the role of world@large is to be a kind of shared
> interface which
> does not govern, but is governed.
>
> Jefsey's architecture is ideal for the "real" @large I
> envisage : not a
> centralised ICANN pressure group, but a long-term network of
> communities
> which has an integrity just being what it is. It is less
> 'political' : it is
> more 'communal'. Whether ICANN succeeds, flourishes, evolves
> or collapses,
> the @large still exists  - and by developing in this way, it
> will strengthen
> its case against ICANN autocracy, and help make the ICANN
> politburo seem
> increasingly isolated, despotic and out of touch.
>
> Richard
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: J-F C. (Jefsey) Morfin <jefsey@club-internet.fr>
> To: <atlarge-panel@lists.fitug.de>
> Cc: <atlarge-discuss@lists.fitug.de>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 2:52 PM
> Subject: [atlarge-discuss] let keep cool, organized and simple
>
>
> > Dear all,
> > I am extremely confused by the situation regarding our
> organization, its
> > name and its web site(s). I am also surprised at the way we cannot
> organize
> > into some reasonable international simple concertance.
> >
> >
> > 1. name
> >
> > We are the @large. That name has history,  definitions,
> records. We are
> not
> > a specific body, we are a crowd, and we want to be a large
> crowd. We do
> not
> > want to be ruled and directed, but helped into common
> understandings and
> > actions.
> >
> > To that end we need some support structures. These
> structures must have a
> > name. That name is natural when we consider the countries (like
> > france@large), by consequence we can think that icann@large will be
> > understood as the @large people interested in ICANN.
> >
> >
> > 2. structure
> >
> > We have elected a panel (the name of which is naturally
> panel@large) and
> we
> > need a small legal structure to embody it, the
> > secretariat  (secretariat@large), the accounting etc...
> That worldwide,
> all
> > Internet and administrative concerns structure needs a name.
> >
> > it can be world@large, internet@large, admin@large.
> >
> > I favor world@large for the reason the "@" is already
> associated with
> > Internet in the brainware and that, by nature, an
> incorporated structure
> is
> > to carry administration. This also frees the names for more
> specific WGs.
> >
> >
> > 3. naming plan / directory
> >
> > we have a brainware built-in directory:
> >
> > - structure: wold@large, admin@large, possibly internet@large
> > - geographic : france@large, new-york@large, etc..
> > - thematic: icann@lagre, isoc@large, gac@large
> >
> > what people do with it, is their cup of tea. Names like:
> >
> > http://workdatlarge.org
> > http://atlarge.ca
> > http://at-large.de
> >
> > are good to me if it is good to them. Anyway I cannot do
> anything about
> it.
> >
> >
> > 4. TLD
> >
> > The idea of including TLD in legal names does not make any
> sense. If there
> > is a TLD, it means it is an address. If there is no TLD, it
> means it is a
> > body.
> >
> > Including TLDs in names has been repetedly refused by WIPO
> and judges as
> > making any difference. It is confusing and only shows that
> the people
> > wearing it have not really understood what DNS is (unless
> the TLD has a
> > particular added meaning, apart from "I have been sold by ISOC").
> >
> > "atlarge.org" can be UDRPed by atlarge.com. A TLD is NO
> part of a name.
> The
> > idea that a name must be on ".com", ".org", ".net" is a US
> centric idea,
> > which is outdated as ".info", ".us" etc. take over.
> >
> > This looks as people giving their telephone number, but not
> bothering
> about
> > the area code. Their forename but not their name. The TLD
> is the area code
> > or the name in an Internet name. Boring to memorize it?
> well if I tell you
> > to send me a mail to "jefsey" and I suppose you know that I am
> > under  "@club-internet.fr" who will be boring who?
> >
> >
> > 4. the atlarge ULD
> >
> > an ULD (upper level domain) is an SLD used as a charter for
> a proposed TLD
> > (see below). Our target as @large is to have new TLDs
> permitted ASAP. The
> > first TLD we want is ".atlarge".
> >
> > To support that project I have initiated though the
> world@wide foundation,
> > the "@LARGE WORLD SYSTEM" (@WS project, to propose,
> organize and operate
> > the ".atlarge" ULD. That project obviously uses the SLD
> ".atlarge.ws" for
> > immediate support and also supports the ".atlarge" TLD as
> part of the
> > ICANN/ICP-3 compliant experimental dot-root project.
> >
> > This project will provide a free Internet name to every @large cell
> > requesting it. It will be managed by the WG-@WS any of you
> can join. Its
> > CIC (Community Information Center) address is http://atlarge.ws.
> >
> > Upon registration an "xyz" @large cell will get the
> following internet
> > names supported:
> > http://xyz.atlarge.ws xyz@large.ws and ---@xyz.atlarge.ws
> > http://xyz.atlarge and ---@xyz.atlarge
> > These internet names can be used as main or alias addresses.
> >
> > Please see the CIC for examples.
> >
> >
> > 5. Site resources
> >
> > We need to help the local cells to establish their own sites. The
> > world@wide foundation can provide free or very low cost
> hosting of sites
> to
> > the WG and local cells - including ftp dedicated access,
> mails and mailing
> > lists. But it has not the management resources to organize
> that. It needs
> help.
> >
> >
> > 6. Aliases
> >
> > It seems that a lot of misunderstandings on the @large name
> issue comes
> > from a lack of command of the aliases. To understand better:
> >
> > - domain names are very specific names of real properties
> (machines, disk
> > space, IP addresses, server etc). They have been used in a
> confusing way.
> > - Internet uses numbers (IP addresses) and names.
> >
> > Internet names are used by the DNS *and* by several other
> functions to get
> > into a defined place.
> > - DNS relates a name to a machine
> > - Apache relates a name on a machine to a virtual host
> > - sendmail etc.. relates a name on a machine to a mailbox
> into a mail
> directory
> >
> > These systems accept aliases. This means that the same place may be
> > accessed with different names. But that information has to
> be provided to
> > the corresponding tool (DNS, Apache, sendmail).
> >
> > The most common use of aliases is the "http://www.name.com"; and
> > "http://name.com";. These are two different Internet names.
> To be supported
> > that names MUST have been entered as aliases (or CNAME in
> DNS wording)
> both
> > in the DNS and in Apache.
> >
> > This means that the *existing* site http://icannatlarge.com
> can be easily
> > accessed as:
> >
> > - http://worldatlarge.org
> > - http://world.atlarge.ws
> > - http://joanna.lane.co.uk
> > - http://www.jeff.williams.tk
> >
> > etc... as long as the IP of the server has been declared in
> the DNS for
> > these names and their www.aliases and that these names have
> been entered
> in
> > the host configuration as aliases. Joop could have made it
> supported for
> > months. He asked for me to point icannatlarge.org to
> icannatlarge,com but
> > never provide the IP and the response on his ability to
> accept it as an
> alias.
> >
> >
> > 7. organization management
> >
> > We obviously have an organization management problem. That
> problem is not
> > the problem of our group; that problem is generic. We want
> to relate by
> > mail between independent people and organizations and to take joint
> > decisions, etc. while having people submitted to very
> strict financial
> > limitations irt access and traffic. This cannot simply be
> done unless we
> > design an appropriate tool. I think we are a unique group of various
> > nations, cultures and competences to specify and test such
> a product. We
> > however need a few designers to program it.
> >
> >
> >  >>> call for help
> >
> > With all this in mind I call for help. In order to :
> >
> > - share in the WG-@WS working group to manage the
> ".atlarge" namespace.
> > - share in a faq@atlarge site and mailing list to help the
> @large people
> to
> > understand how to build the Internet presence of their cell
> > - share in the specification and the development of a generic tool
> > supporting our management. I suppose it should be written
> in C for the
> > server site and in Java for a local applet.
> >
> > jfc
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> --------------
> ----
>
>
> >
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