Re: [atlarge-discuss] The ICANNatlarge.com web page

[Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com>]

Joop and all stakeholders or other interested parties,

Joop, you have no justification of argument(s) regarding the costs/money
you say were accumulated for ICANNATLARGE.COM that were
put into your pocket as from the beginning the ICANNATLARGE.COM
was offered free hosting and Webmaster services from Hi-Tek.com
by Eric.

  So the more you beat this drum the less creditable you look and
the more reduction in creditability you heap upon the members.
Please discontinue such nonsense...  Stand up like a man and admit
you made a huge mistake and take your medicine...

  Now that matter cleared up yet again, you know that if as you
espouse to believe such democratic orgs such as ICANNATLARGE.COM
in their early and formative days/weeks/even months, have such
web master services donated.  So why have you charged for such
services?  Well I really don't know, but I suspect that it is because
you legal work is and has been faltering for several years, you needed
the money badly, and you took unfair and unnecessary advantage
of a situation in a way that was unnecessary and frankly disgusting.

Stop doing things like that please!  You do have some very good
ideas.  Don't throw them into the trash with such behavior...

Joop Teernstra wrote:

> At 07:59 a.m. 2/08/2002 -0400, James Love wrote:
> >Joop Teernstra wrote:
> >>I see you choose to maintain the myth of the webmaster billing the panel.
> >>THIS IS NOT THE CASE.
> >>All I am doing is maintain a transparent view of the cost of the work, of
> >>the pledges made and of the donations received.
> >
> >        What do you mean "the cost of the work."?
>
> Sigh.  This thread will continue as long as you keep not-knowing and not
> understanding. (I am putting it mildly)
> The cost of the work means the cost to *me* or anyone who does the work. In
> time and in money.
>
> >  The NCC has never paid anyone to maintain its web site, which has been
> > done by volunteers.
>
> The NCDNHC website is exactly an example of how icannatlarge should NOT do
> it. It is hosted by ISOC and dependent on their goodwill for updates.
>   As for its navigation properties and its latest update, have a look
> before you hold it up as an example. http://www.ncdnhc.org/  ("the next
> ICANN meeting will be held in Accra")
>
> >I am not opposed to considering paying a webmaster, if and when we have
> >resources to do so, if that is the best place to spend the money, but I
> >don't see how we can have someone running up liabilities without some
> >agreement as to what work is authorized at what price.
>
> The only person running up liabilities was/is me.
>
> >>Who were those 3 members that were to be trusted (by informal consensus,
> >>not by vote) with the keys? When was I informed of this?
> >
> >     As I indicated earlier and posted links to the panel discussions, it
> > was the Chair (VB), Vice-Chair (Izumi) and SS.  I don't know what your
> > communication has been with VB on this.  I had tried to stay out of the
> > web page issue, although obviously recently I have taken a bigger interest.
>
> As a Panel member, should you not be informed about communications like that?
>
> >>>  Even small stuff wasn't being fixed, like making it more clear that
> >>> "register here" meant... sign up to become a member... or something more clear.
> >>
> >>That  was done within 12 hours after it was asked.  Sheesh!
> >
> >    Huh?  It still says "register here."   Register for what?  You have to
> > read the page to the end to even see that this is the how you join the
> > organization.  The word "join" would be easier to understand than
> > "register", IMO.
>
> NOW you explain what you mean. Yes, of course, that can be changed. If it
> was urgent, more Panel members would have asked me. As I understood, you
> wanted a clear message about registering to vote. I did that promptly.
>
> >>VB was  wrong :
> >>1. telling you that he had to invoice InternetNZ - that was not the case.
> >>2. using his power as panel chair to hold up the payment in order to
> >>demand control over the keys of the website at a point in time that his
> >>mandate was expiring.
> >
> >       Why was he wrong?  He was asking for this a long time ago.  If you
> > were refusing to do something simple like share the passwords,
>
> If you cannot see what was wrong here, the icannatlarge will elect you at
> its peril.
>
> >  but expecting the panel to go out and get you $1,000, maybe you should
> > think about how your actions were being percieved.  Not sharing the
> > passwords was considered a pretty hostile act, if not paranoid.
>
> The hostility started out of the blue with Sotiris' attack and Vittorio
> supporting that by demanding the keys for Sotiris and himself immediately
> after.
> Enough reason to be cautious and wait for the outcome of a full vote. I
> have seen a few coups before, in real life and on-line.
> I had already passed on the hosting to Bret Fausett, so if there was a real
> need Bret could have given out passwords.
>
> >  Ok, Esther picked you to run the site.
>
> Esther Dyson did no such thing. Go back to the ALSG archive. Pindar Wong
> challenged me to create the site and I took up the challenge. He did it as
> his last parting shot to an ICANN that he no longer wants to have anything
> to do with. Let me reveal here that Esther's donation was the result of my
> own rude armtwisting. I felt betrayed with all of her pledge of $10.000
> being offered to Alexander Svennson. (and later Denise)
> Esther can confirm this if she cares.
>
> >  Fine.  But that wasn't a permanent position.  Now the panel's temporary
> > mandate is about over, with the new election over next week.   But this
> > was a problem before we got to Bucharest.
>
> Even before the first Panel was elected I told everyone to look for
> somebody else to run the site.
> http://www.icannatlarge.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=171
>
> ><snip>
>
> >     The first panel set up a public archived list for decision making....
> > which wasn't even linked to the web page for a long time, and until very
> > recently was hard to find.
>
> What concerns me is your repeating of factoids that are untrue. The links
> have been there from the very beginning and it is not hard to prove that.
>
> --Joop
>
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Regards,
--
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup - (Over 124k members/stakeholders strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com
Contact Number:  972-244-3801 or 214-244-4827
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208



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